Let us face the challange

I understand your sentiments. Right from the days the Muslims first came to India, they had only one object and that was to subjugate India. They succeeded with the arrival Mohammad Ghori and Baber and ruled India, draining it of her wealth and talent. It was only with the arrival of Guru Gobind Singh and Chatrapathi Shivaji that the Hindus started recovering their strength. But this was again depleted with the arrival of the British and the missionaries. By the time independence came, the Hindus were so weak that a Jinnah could blackmail Congress and get Pakistan.
Once again the tables began to turn on December 6th, 2002 and Hindus saw a new hope and unity when the greatest sign of subjection was demolished and a makeshift Ram Mandir was built in its place. But this was short-lived because the BJP could not follow up the momentum and build the Ram Janmabhoomi Mandir and declare India as Hindu Rashtra. Now once again the future of the Hindus is threatened with the UPA government, controlled by Vatican mole Sonia Gandhi, in power. Our only chance of victory is to strengthen the RSS and its parivar organizations. We have to build up our strength and the best way is to strengthen the shakha network, through which men of sterling qualities would be made to lead the Hindu nation to reach the pinnacle of glory. Let each swayamsevak think how he can contribute to the victory of Hindutva. Let us expose the hollow religion that Islam is. Let us express the universal and spiritual vision of Hinduism powerfully.

Heaven on Earth

From the point of view of man as he is constituted now, existence is seen in the dual mode. He is trapped in the duality mode with his like/dislike dichotomy. What spirituality enables us is (1) to be able to see the perfection in this world of duality by seeing the cause and effect link, (2) to develop our capacity to overcome our like/dislike dichotomy and (3) to thereafter stabilize us in the realm of non-duality.

However, while those who have reached the realm of non-duality enjoy its bliss, the mass of humanity continue to suffer - having not yet reached the higher stage. Up till now spiritual masters sought to raise the suffering masses one at a time and succeeded only with the active participation of the suffering individual.

Probably for the first time in history, Aurobindo sought to raise the suffering masses to the higher stage even without the active participation of the masses by bring down the light of oneness. He sought to augment evolution on a mass scale, an idea, it is said, the Vedas had in its seed form. Aurobindo experimented with methods and declared success and his followers look forward to his efforts bearing fruit in the not too-distant future, as Aurobindo did the ground work even while he was in his physical form, continued after his death by the Mother. Their efforts are predicted to bear full fruit with the tying-up of loose ends going on even now by Aurobindo and the Mother at their higher level of existence.

I would think when such an age dawns, violence shall totally end, with even the tiger and deer living in harmony. Probably pranic energy would take care of sustenance.

Divine Perfection

In describing myself I do not like to describe myself as representative of any particular thought, because I find beautiful thoughts expressed eloquently everywhere and consider myself an inheritor of them all. But in summation of what might be called eastern thoughts, I have somewhat come to the conclusion that we are perfect and our circumstances are perfect. Our failure to realise this, due to our like-dislike conditioning is the cause of our fragmented mind and a sense of lack. When we get back our wholesome mind, all restlessness and violence will evaporate from our actions. Then perfection will be a reality in a divine way.

But what about ritual massacre of animals?

What you've said, "Muslims at Hajj are one people", is no doubt true in letter and spirit during the Hajj. This brotherhood of humans (or believers) is verily the spirit of Hajj. My question is, would it not have been even more glorious for Islam if that oneness is spread to all creation and included at least the animals, sparing the poor goats from ritual massacre?

Mercy is encouraged in everything, including the slaughter...There are some requirements of the slaughter in Islam, one of them is to sharpen the blade to relieve the pain of the animals.

Also the sacrifice is given to the poor and the needy.

I think you are completely off the point. The mercy offered here is as between AC current and DC current in capital punishment. Moreover, who has sacrificed here? The goat? A greater sacrifice would have been to go vegetarian.

Ah, I see....It is a massacre if Muslims are doing it in Eid Al-adha, and a celebration if Americans are doing it in their thanksgiving day!

Look, this sort of reply does no good to your claim that Islam is the final and complete religion of God. Therefore how do you compare what Islam teaches and what is the practice of Americans in memory of their arrival in America?

Why is it inhumane to think of animals as food? To take a stance like that is being blind to the overall picture of the way we produce food. In some places in the world, growing crop is not a possibility, furthermore trying to grow crop where it does not naturally grow is overall more harmful to the world and its environment (which include animals). Human were made to be omnivores (look at our teeth) and as such we eat living things to survive (be it plant or animal).

The sacrifice of the animal is not for its blood to reach God. The sacrifice is to show you are willing to donate a part of your property for the sake of God, by donating meat to the needy.

The animal is killed in a humane way. Look at the research on the way Muslims slaughter their meat.


The question is not about man eating animals. Some men used to eat other men. The question is about religion and it culturing influence. If religion caters to the baser instincts of man, then such a religion is more a populist religion than a culturing religion. If any sacrifice is to be made at all, why make animals the scapegoat and try to gain merit on account of it? Killing in a humane way is a contradiction of terms.

Elsewhere in RF there is a thread about mass massacre of animals in a Hindu temple in Nepal. So this ritual is not unique to Mecca. However, the difference is that this ritual is sought to be ended, as it has in many other temples, by reformists. In Islam there is no reformer in sight.

Since I've been advised that I am not to "argue" in Islam directory, I am withdrawing my comments and the Moderator may delete the same. I would like to open another thread. Do I have your permission to quote your comments there?

I don't understand what your problem is exactly!! I don't know why some people adore arguing for nothing.
The sacrifice is not confined to the pilgrims but to all Muslims around the globe.
Nothing is wrong with killing animals for food. And nothing wrong at all with the emphasis on the sacrifice in Eid.
We don't need any kind of reformation regarding this issue. But what we need is to emphasize on how to treat the animals well before their slaughtering like what Sajdah said. Some butchers slaughter them in front of each other which is wrong, we need to correct such behaviors.

I am aware that all Muslims sacrifice animals on the day of the Hajj, not just those physically present in Mecca. As a matter the Hajj Eid (celebration) is called Bakri (Goat) Eid by Muslims in the Indian sub-continent. That animals have been killed for food by a majority of mankind since the beginning of history may be a fact. But facts need not be steeped in righteousness. If cannibalism is today considered uncivilized, it could well be that non-vegetarianism might be considered uncivilized in the future. No doubt treating the animals "well before their slaughter" is a step forward in the evolution of man's culture. May Muslims take a fresh look at this ritual from the viewpoint of "ijtihad" or independent reasoning, which I understand is sanctioned by the Quran.

http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/islam/89241-hajj-celebration-peace.html#post1782272

Countering the white-washing of history

Shivaji-Afzal Khan encounter marks the change of tide in the affairs of Hindus in India. Being subjugated by Muslims for over 500 years, the first stirrings of a Hindu re-bounce were perceived in the religious movement led by Guru Nanak and a 100 years later, in the political activities of Shivaji Maharaj. Had the result of the encounter been otherwise, Hindus would have lost their self confidence so totally that a revival could have been ruled out. However, Hindu-might in full flow was yet a distant possibility and the British could extend their suzerainty to the whole of India without much resistance. British rule, in its turn, would have marked the total triumph of the missionaries in converting the bulk of Hindus. But that was not to be because another encounter took place a 100 years ago – between Ramakrishna Parmahamsa and Narendra Dutta, later to be known the world over as Swami Vivekananda. Swami Vivekananda began a spiritual rediscovery among the Hindus, the reverberations of which continue manifesting more and more a hundred years since the charismatic Swami delivered his Advaitic message. A recent survey of church-goers in America pointed out that 76% of them had incorporated Hindu views in their religious outlook. Just as it took a hundred years for a Shivaji to follow a Nanak, a 100 years after Vivekananda, another Narendra, Narendra Modi, is symbolizing a Hindu political ascendancy. It is clear that Hinduism is on the verge of hoisting its triumphant saffron flag on the pages of history after long 1000 years of enfeeblement.

It is this triumphant march that is being sought to be whitewashed by those who do not want the depiction of Shivaji’s victory over Afzal Khan to inspire the present generation. It is this whitewash of history that is reflected in Jaswant Singh's ‘scholarly’ tome on Jinnah. Whitewashing history, incidentally, is a favourite Muslim trait, where they seek to whitewash the blood-stained progress of Islam through the annals of history because it counters their proclaimed stand that Islam is a religion of peace.

Bal Thackeray’s call to plaster the pictureisation of the victory of Shivaji over Afzal Khan all over the place is a call that should be taken up with alacrity by Hindus if they are to seize this moment and defeat the forces that wish to stall its onward march to glory.

The cause of suffering

Dear Kgana, We suffer if we do not know that we and our circumstances are perfect, were always perfect and will ever be perfect. If we see that one thing leads to another, we would see the inevitability of the situation we are in. An effect has necessarily to be in a certain way because we determined the cause to be in a certain way. How we now react to the effect determines the type of cause we generate for future effect. So the chain is always perfect and when we see the perfection at play, we would not try to change anything but our reaction to a happening. This acceptance of the effect will cause suffering to end and the effect, however horrible it may have seemed at one time, becomes the cause of awakening to the bliss of perfection.

The stroke that has affected your mother is no doubt causing her and all who love her to suffer. Your mother, in the midst of actual suffering, has to take the aid of medical science to get over her immediate suffering. When she is much better, by and by she has to practise techniques of calming the mind, like mantra-recitation. From the vantage point of a calm mind, she would be able to see the perfection of her life and she would never suffer again, come what may.

Varun Gandhi, well spoken

"Hinduon ki taraf jo haath uthega, ussey Varun Gandhi rokegaa nahin kaat dega", said Varun Gandhi during a meeting in Pilibhit. Attaboy, Varun. You have given the assurance that Hindus want so badly to hear. Hindus have thus far only been hearing that Islam bears Hindus no ill-will - Islam, fancy - the sworn idol smashers!

The non-dual freedom of life

It is erroneous to assume that a person in the non-dual state fails to notice the dualistic reality of life - it is just that he refuses to get trapped in the dualistic dichotomy of life. Therefore he lives a life of freedom.

Testing times

A ship is built to sail on waters, not merely for display in a harbour. Similarly, a general is expected to lead his troops in the theatre of war. He can be tested only on the battlefield. A general is barely tested in peace time.

The world of words

Seeing a stranger, we are not imbued with any power to guess his name. We have to be introduced to get his name. Similarly, for example, our seeing a tree does not necessarily give us the word ‘tree’. Tree is a thing which is so named. Why do we name things? For the sake of communication, of course. If I have met Narayanan and want to tell my friend so, I need to name him to my friend. Otherwise both of us have to be sufficiently patient for me to describe Narayanan for my friend to recognize whom I am talking about. This process is too cumbersome for it to be repeated every time I want to talk about Narayanan to different people. Moreover, Narayanan may mean different things to different people. Therefore I would have to describe him to each differently for him to be properly recognized. Why such labour in communication when I can describe him with a single word. Therefore we see why words are required. For communication – and not just with others, but with ourselves too. Otherwise we are bound to confuse ourselves!